Episode 113: Empowering Women in STEM with Nicole Tschierske

On the latest episode of the Career Clarity Show, we’re joined by our guest expert, Nicole Tschierske. Nicole is a scientist and a positive psychology coach. She helps her clients strategically turn their career frustrations into a renewed love for their work and is passionate about helping overlooked women in STEM become influential, so they can confidently unlock new opportunities for themselves.

We talk about figuring out how to thrive and how to find your voice and step into a sense of satisfaction and forward motion in your career, particularly if you end up in an area where your voice is underrepresented. So if you are someone who is in a career path where you feel under appreciated, under fulfilled, and like you’re not living up to your potential, particularly if you are in an industry that tends to be dominated by people who don’t look like you – this episode is for you!

Want to learn more about our strategic framework for successful career change? Download The Roadmap to Career Fulfillment ebook right here!

Show Notes:

• Plan for Progress Workshop
• Into Action Coaching
• LinkedIn: Dr. Nicole Tschierske
• Women In Stem Reimaged Masterclass
• Roadmap to a Fulfilling Career eBook

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Transcript:

Lisa Lewis Miller  0:04

Welcome to the Career Clarity Show. If you want to create a career path you’ll love, you’re in the right place. I’m Lisa Lewis Miller, career change coach, published author and your host. And each week, we’ll bring you personal transformation stories, advice and insights from experts about how you can find a more fulfilling, soulful and joyful career.

Welcome back to the Career Clarity Show. And thank you as always, for joining us. I’m your host, Lisa Miller. And I’m delighted to have you with us today, especially if you identify as a woman, and you identify as somebody who doesn’t exactly fit where you’ve been planted in your career. On today’s episode of the podcast, we are talking about being under appreciated under fulfilled and feeling like you’re not living up to your potential, particularly if you are in an industry that tends not to be there tends to be dominated by people who don’t look like you. That tends to be a place where there are not a whole lot of other people who look like you. And for today’s episode, we’re talking about that specific to the world of STEM. I’m so excited to have today’s guest with us today, because she is an expert on figuring out how to thrive and how to find your voice and step into a sense of satisfaction and forward motion in your career, particularly if you end up in an area where your voice is definitely underrepresented. So if you are someone who is in a career path where you feel like you haven’t been able to step into owning your own voice, and sharing what you believe in and what you know, and what you’re learning to the fullest extent of your capability, but you want to or you’ve been feeling like you don’t exactly fit where you are. And you’ve been wondering if it’s time to make a career change or if there might be ways to salvage things and to thrive where you’re planted. You’re gonna love today’s episode of the podcast. Now, let me introduce you to today’s guest. Today’s guest is Nicole gyroscope. Nicole is passionate about helping overlooked women in STEM become influential, so they can confidently unlock new opportunities for themselves and get their employers saying we need you on this job and make a bigger impact. As a scientist and a positive psychology coach, Nicole helps her clients strategically turn their career frustrations into a renewed love for their work. Nicole, welcome to the Career Clarity Show.

Nicole Tschierske  2:38  

Hi, Lisa, thanks for having me. I’m so looking forward to our conversation.

Lisa Lewis Miller  2:42  

Well, I am delighted to have you here with us. And I feel like where we have to start the conversation is around what what makes you passionate and gets you excited about helping women to unlock opportunities become influential, and have a renewed love for their work. Yes,

Nicole Tschierske  3:04  

this is really my whole mission in life. Basically, I want everybody to enjoy their work because we have to be at work for decades. And this is too long a time to be miserable each day. Really, really. And I sadly, I see that for so many people where they end up in jobs, where the pay isn’t decent, where they are treated unfairly, all of those things and just breaks my heart. And I need to start somewhere. So I thought, Okay, I’m gonna start with the people that I can empathize best with, because I have lift through what they are living through. And that is women in the STEM fields. Because, like I said, I’m a scientist by training as well. And the first years of my career while I was doing subject matter wise, absolutely what I loved and Okay, yesterday, I also had great managers and I had a great team to work with all of this, there was still always that feeling of, of hitting of hitting a wall in some aspects, you know, of never going really further or really getting the recognition for the work that I fought my work deserved. And, and to, you know, be be able to have my ideas heard and implemented. And to really, yeah, just to be part of the game really, really, you know, not just at the lab bench. And yeah, and so I through everything that I have learned from my own career journey, and in my coaching, training and all of that I now pass that on to as many women in STEM, do that so they can learn from from my journey and also maybe don’t feel so alone if they if they feel like okay, this isn’t going for what seems like me Many of us are going through this.

Lisa Lewis Miller  5:02  

Absolutely. And I think one of the biggest challenges for people who identify as women in industries where they’re underrepresented, like the entire stem world, is wrestling with this question of, is it me? Or is it the job? Is it the industry? Is it the employer? You know, am I am I ever going to find a place that feels good to where I can feel supported and be recognized. And I’m wondering what your take on this is.

Nicole Tschierske  5:34  

My take on this is it’s all of it. It’s us. But it’s also the employer. And it is the industry. And I so appreciate the work that so many diversity and inclusion experts are doing with companies I so appreciate every company that puts their money where their mouth is in terms of really starting to promote and support just any marginalized group in their, in their business or in their organization. But where my personal jam really is, you know, what, what I like doing most is really work with the individuals. Because what I see often and what I hear my clients say is that, you know, okay, I’m in a great team, my boss is supportive of me. And yet, I still don’t dare to speak up. And yet, I still, you know, fiddle around in the back. And yet, I still don’t, you know, try to reach out to that other senior manager, and so on. So, why, again, the companies need to do their part. And this systemic change is so, so important in order to, you know, provide those equal opportunities for everyone. At the same time, if we don’t have women, or just anyone else who fears they’re basically stuck in this helplessness, if we don’t support them in taking a leap, and trusting in their own strengths in their own uniqueness, and really fully showing up and contributing in that way, then we’re missing half of the equation.

Lisa Lewis Miller  7:13  

Absolutely, and it’s, it’s such a challenging dilemma, because one thing that I’ve I’ve learned, you know, through my, my time doing this work is that if you belong to an underrepresented group, or an underrepresented identity, so often, when you do use your voice and speak up, you aren’t seen as a, an individual, you’re seen as a representation of your group. Right? So it could be a racial or ethnic group, like if you are the one black individual on the team, you become the voice of all black people. It can be gender identity question of if you are raising your voice as a woman, you become the token representation of all women. And that can come with a lot of extra pressure, that if you haven’t been in the experience of being under represented, you might not see and might not understand. I’m curious how you hear that come up for your clients, you know, do they feel a lot of extra pressure or like there’s an extra spotlight or extra visibility on them when they’re speaking up? That makes it feel high stakes? Hmm.

Nicole Tschierske  8:29  

Okay. My clients are not a statistically representative number of people. So it’s really just anecdotal and individual experiences. But funnily enough, I mean, I love how you put that question. And it’s so so true. Because whether we speak up or we hold back, we are, we are showing up as, you know, someone of our kind, and then it just paints a picture in people’s head. Plus, if there’s just one other like us at the table, and if they see us not doing or doing certain things, then they will consider this also as as the norm for people like us, so to speak. So there is this extra pressure, but I have the feeling. We’re not all, you know, so attentive to this, you know, oftentimes the focus is really inward and on that’s what I experienced with my clients. Why is it me? Why is it me It only comes out when they then go back to their to their own peer group, and then they basically complain about with each other, how unfair, everything is at work. But when it comes to showing up, you know, where we have the choice of, okay, am I being or, you know, am I doing my best to being a trailblazer and a role model here? Or am I holding myself back because whatever fear is going on inside of me, then that never really factors in and so I really like the advice that you know, especially Especially many, many experts who work with people on salary negotiations and so on, because this is where the gap really becomes so huge, okay, you can see it that numbers literally, then they always advise, like, even if you would be satisfied with whatever is being offered, you still ask for more, you know, as a matter of principle, and just to just to set the expectation or the the picture also that that, you knows, we are well within our rights to negotiate up. And in the same way, I would suggest that’s actually a really great question. I guess I will bring more to the coaching conversations that I will have. So okay, so is what you’re doing here inspiring others to be their best self? Or is it not? And I guess that reflection can be an extra Moody, yes, it can be a lot of pressure. But it could also be an extra motivation for us to go outside our comfort zone.

Lisa Lewis Miller  11:01  

Nicole, I think that’s such a powerful reframe of by speaking up by taking this step, who else might you be empowering and inspiring, because it’s, it’s taking the exact same situation and looking through it such through such an empowering lens, as opposed to the fear based lens, the circumstances and situation might be the same, but the way that you can relate to the situation and circumstances cannot be really different. And I know one of the things that has come up. When I’ve spoken to people about imposter syndrome and self confidence and self doubt before is that coalition building can be a really important thing to do to gather other people who can give you external opinions and advice and share with them so you can build up some other people to support you and your ideas when you voice them. How does this show up for you and your clients in in their work?

Nicole Tschierske  12:05  

Yeah, so I’m a big proponent of having a promo squad, you know, so if you are, if you’re huddling around regularly to complain about how nobody sees you, nobody recognizes you, and all of that, then why not? You know, you said if you have three or four people, then why not speak positively about each other in different meetings on different occasions or make introductions, you know, to other people for each other, you know, so to turn that to not focus on everything that is not there. But, you know, really shift that attention and to what you could really do for each other and what is even sometimes it’s the small things, but we just have to do it often enough, you know? So yeah, absolutely. I that’s one of the first things that I advise.

Lisa Lewis Miller  12:57  

I love that. Well, I want to come back to this question of, is it me? Is it the job and trying to find a path towards more satisfaction, because one of the things that I know that you talk about is that if you’re starting to feel under challenged or overlooked, your first instinct doesn’t have to be looking for a new job and jumping ship and going to find another opportunity. When you encounter someone who’s feeling that sense of not being engaged, feeling like you’re hitting a ceiling, how do you advise them?

Nicole Tschierske  13:34  

Yeah, so the reason that I that I say that, I mean, obviously, if you are, if you have openly discriminated against, or if you have been, you know, put on the on the back burner for years, even though you have raised your hand consistently, and you have volunteered for opportunities and delivered outstanding work, and there just is no progress anywhere, then by all means leave, yes. But sometimes what I noticed in myself, but also in other women in STEM that when we, when we take on a new role, we’re we’re just typically a little bit above of what we already know and can do you know, so there’s this, this phase of really growing and developing into that at the beginning the first six months to a year and that is really exciting that this may be often also sprinkled with a little bit of overwhelm all of these kind of so many things to be figured out. But we’re learning and we’re growing and we’re having the challenge and this is what we would really intrinsically motivates us. And I’m saying asked because I have spoken to quite a number of people and maybe even other people can identify with that feeling of having that challenge and wanting that, that growth. And then we start to hit the sweet spot where we learn just as much as we deliver really valuable output. And this goes on is like really steep curve. And then at some point with it starts to plateau a little, or at least that’s what it feels like, you know where it’s like, okay, it’s like, I’ve done all of this before. I know how to do these things. I know everybody who’s you know, how to collaborate with them, and so on. And then we say, there’s not a real challenge anymore here. And this might happen, and sometimes after 18 months, or two years, and then that’s, that’s the moment when a lot of people say, I feel under challenged, I feel like I’m not really making any progress, and so on. And I need to find a new job. However, what might happen when you now at this point, and you obviously you can, you can go find a new job if you want that type of new challenge. But what might happen then is you miss out on an opportunity of having enormous bandwidth, to train the skirts, and develop all of those things that you don’t have the bandwidth for, when you jump into a new job, where you start from zero with all the technical aspects. Again, when you start building your network, again, when you’re starting to get to know the ins and outs of it again. And so at this two year mark, so maybe spend another year and really dive deep into all of those other skills that you otherwise don’t have the time to, you know, like, get the next level up in your stakeholder management, or start to develop your leadership skills by mentoring others, or improve your communication skills, see how you can become more influential in even your current role. Because those are the skills that will serve you very well in whatever next role is about to come. So you can kind of create your own new challenge with that. And, yeah, so that that’s a really awesome opportunity there.

Lisa Lewis Miller  16:51  

Absolutely. And I think that’s such a helpful way to think about your current role. If you’re not certain that it’s time to go. And you know, here at career clarity, we talk a lot about the four pillars of career fulfillment, and these four dimensions of satisfaction. Are you using your strengths and gifts and feeling challenged? Do you feel like you have strong magnetic poles towards the areas of the problems that you’re solving? Right? Is there alignment with your interest there? Do you feel like you have a good personality fit with the organization and your manager and your team? And then do you feel like the compensation and lifestyle feel good? And often what we find is that when just one of those four pillars, is not being fulfilled? That thinking exactly as you’ve outlined about, well, how can I use this opportunity where I have more bandwidth to ask for or create what I want, can really create a beautiful situation for you, and one that might even be better than what’s available to you if you were to leave. But I think it’s to your point earlier that if you feel like you are consistently not being heard, and you’ve tried to make changes and have not had them be successful, you know, or you’re feeling like you have multiple of your pillars of fulfillment that are out of alignment, leaving may absolutely be the right decision. Yeah, but I want to come back to something that you had said a moment ago, because when you’re talking about the desire to make things better at your current situation, and raising your hand and trying to to be heard and trying to create a situation that feels good and feeling like you’re unsuccessful in that there’s a bit of a nuance to it around communicating in a way that makes your ideas heard, and makes you able to be influential and makes it possible to create change. And I will say that I am running up against this and a project that I’m working on, I’m doing some consulting with an organization right now. And that leadership team is predominantly male. And I will say things and have a really difficult time having them be heard. And then another male person on the team might say the exact same idea but in a little bit of a different language. And they’ll talk about it like it’s a revelation. So what advice do you have for women who are in a situation like mine, where you think you are using your voice or you’re trying to speak up, but you feel like your ideas are not being heard, or appreciated or acknowledged or implemented?

Nicole Tschierske  19:19  

Hmm, this is such a so know how you feel I have had happen to me to where they leave the meetings like how’s this even possible? Like we said the exact same thing, and yet, so I always send check in with me, okay, what’s important? What’s more important here to like for me to get the job done? Or to have my ego? Pettit? Yes. So and then that is for me, and again, the the answer to discretion, everybody has to find their own. But for me and this might also need, you know, vary depending on the situation and the moment. Obviously, if you have done the majority of the work You want to make sure that your name is associated with that, and, and you build that reputation. However, if I’m, if I’m super passionate about an idea and want to make sure that people jump on it and it gets implemented, and the idea is bigger than I am, then I employ whatever whatever tactics are useful. I mean, with integrity, obviously, but whatever helps, and if that means I have to engage with some of the, you know, male colleagues whose voice might bear more weight, I would say outside of the meeting, and just see if I can form an alleged trip with them, and if I can get them on board. And, you know, if, if that helps advance my cause, then by all means, I’m going to do this. The other thing, though, is, yes, we do want to have our voice heard. However, if we keep repeating that sentence to ourselves, then the only intention that we have attention that we have is on ourselves, however, when we’re communicating with others, especially to influence is, then we need to put the spotlight on them. Because people are selfish. And it just is like this, and everybody just cares about themselves and how whatever you’re proposing makes things better or worse for them. And so that is why we need to turn it around, we really need to practice our strengths of empathy, and perspective taking, and all of this and ensure that we not only understand where the other person is, but also how I need to speak to them, and what is important to them, what matters to them, and how I have to present my idea in a way that means something for them, and that they can make they really can get behind that. And, again, we’re not, we’re not talking about being you know, doing sleazy propaganda here, we still want to be honest and truthful. But things can always be seen from different angles. And we just, we can’t just present our own anger because it just you know, if I’m, if I’m a scientist, or a product developer, then having like, whatever I don’t know, it’s like a cheap formulation experience, or, you know, in the lab, it doesn’t matter to the marketer who has a completely different job to do with that, you know, so he has article is like selling the product later on. So we always have to be mindful of thinking from other people’s perspective, and that is really the first and biggest obstacle to overcome to to really have our ideas heard and acted on.

Lisa Lewis Miller  22:41  

So appreciate you sharing that, because I think that there, there are two truths. One is that you’re absolutely right for anybody to be an effective communicator, perspective taking, thinking about empathy, coalition building are all really smart tactics to use, which is amazing. And we actually, there’s an episode of the Career Clarity Show for anybody who’s interested in wants to go deeper into the communication piece, and how it takes two to tango. There’s a fabulous episode with Casey and Julia vital voice training that can expand on this even further. But I think we also have to acknowledge that I think that underrepresented identities, including women, tend to bear a lot more of the the burden, the emotional labor burden in doing the perspective taking and the empathy and the coalition building than other folks. So I think that yes, you’re absolutely right, that those are that the right tactics to use, and they are ones that will make you more influential and more successful. And I think we can also acknowledge that there’s a little bit of an unfairness in that. So but I think that everything that you’ve shared is is spot on. And the fact that we’re not just communicating into a void into a vacuum, you know, shouting at a brick wall, that we’re really trying to speak to another human and that therefore, understanding their humaneness and their needs and their values is going to be a critically important part of being able to be effective no matter what. Yeah. Well, let me ask you, for someone who is feeling like they love their work, but they have run into issues where they’ve done everything in their power to be heard. They are not able to create the kind of path that they want within their existing organization for whatever reason. What advice and counsel Do you give people who are thinking about creating their own career path and taking a step off the corporate ladder that might have been in front of them?

Nicole Tschierske  24:50  

So first of all, have you really looked because I remember that happened, you know, when I was stuck in my career, and I thought I had tried everything. Well, I, I had spoken to my manager, like, almost, you know, every month pleading and begging to help me out to his boss. And I’ve heard so, so stuck. And it was only after then I also spoke to a coach and, you know, started to get a bit more creative again and started knocking on completely new doors. That, you know, and especially if you’re working in a big corporate company, where there’s maybe 1000s of employees, like, are you sure you really have knocked on every door. So there might be opportunities that are that are, you know, you couldn’t even conceive of so that is, that is one things like, but I take your point, sometimes it’s just, there’s just no way in then some, then the next thing you can do is, I have seen that happen so often now is that people put on put their resignation on the table and say, Look, everyone I have, I have tried, I have said it so many times, nothing is moving, I’m going. And then all of a sudden HR says yes, I’m gonna, I’m just gonna leave that here for now. Give me a week. And then within a week, all of a sudden, there’s this crazy new opportunity coming up. And, again, so I’m not suggesting that this works every time. So be prepared to go through with it if if you do that, but again, like, it’s sometimes you’re really surprised with how out of nowhere, suddenly opportunities pop up. Yeah, and then, but as to finding other other ways to get engaged and to try things. I mean, I’m not, I mean, I started building my own coaching practice, but I’m doing that aside my corporate job, so I’m still employed part time, and I’m so glad I do, because that building your own business is nowhere near shiny, it is messy it is. It is not linear and logical, like we wanted to have in science, or I’m just too stupid to do it, I don’t know. But just you know, it’s like that getting those things off the ground is it is really, really hard. So in order to, you know, like, see if you can dial it down, it’s like, whatever your efforts are in your current job, maybe you can even reduce your time there, you know, but if you are as risk averse as I am, and you want to keep your steady paycheck, then you can do that, and get engaged in other in other things. So this can range from setting up your own freelance business to getting involved in volunteering, you know, more more seriously for a cause that you believe in, to just mentoring others or to, to really, you know, rank up your efforts in terms of reaching out and building your network outside of your companies. So, but this is, so I guess, I guess this is just my personal preference to have these kind of longer term view, you know, where do I want to be six to 12 months from now? And therefore, what tiny shifts? Am I starting to do? Now? Other people might be wired completely differently. And it’s your case, like, no, I take a decision today and action tomorrow, and it’s gonna be radical. So whatever floats your boat here, and it’s more aligned with, with how you really take as a person, then fight. Yeah, just brainstorm those strategies. And if you’re really, really stuck, I always recommend getting a mentor who is not, you know, your family, or your friends, or your immediate boss or peers, but someone who has no vested interested in whatever you are doing and can just really had to give the best advice for you.

Lisa Lewis Miller  29:02  

I think that that’s brilliant advice. And and so spot on, because getting an external perspective is sometimes the best way to see what is actually happening in your situation and realize, Oh, goodness, I should have left a long time ago, this is actually really toxic or abusive, more, Hmm, maybe there is a stone left unturned for me here. Maybe there is something else that I should ask for, and check on. So I think that that all makes a ton of sense. And I appreciate you sharing your own personal biases towards risk management because I think a lot of the people who are part of our Career Clarity Show community are risk averse, and want to be careful and thoughtful and are analytical and want to have a process and a strategy to what they are trying and why. So thinking about these baby step actions and ways to test out possibilities is probably landing really well with listeners listeners. If you agree, let us know and then Got some feedback then as I comment on Apple podcasts, but I think that there’s some real virtue in finding ways to plant a lot of seeds to see what, what is going to sprout what’s going to bear fruit. And planting seeds through volunteering or informational interviews or freelance work or taking a course or whatever, can be so helpful to both. Especially if you feel like you’re languishing in your current job, it can be helpful to give you both a little extra burst of energy and remind you that you you do like to be of service and you do like to learn. But then it can also be a great way to create a feedback loop to say, okay, is this the direction that I want my career to grow in that will feel life giving and sustainable and in alignment with my values? Or is this really shiny and exciting on its face, but doesn’t actually speak to my strengths and gifts? Or my current prioritize needs? Or the kind of lifestyle that I want to be building in this season of

Nicole Tschierske  31:05  

life? Yeah, and you only know once you do it, because and that’s that’s another thing, you know, from what point are you comparing or imagining of, you know, so that is, if you’re really frustrated, or like you say languishing in where you are right now that everything else will look better, whether it really will be or not, everything else will look better. And you cannot compare the worst of one thing with the best imagination of another thing, but you need to compare like for, like, you know, so Okay, what, what would the worst day in that dream opportunity look like? And what does the best day in my current job look like? You know, and then really compare those things and and see how that insight resonates with you. But yeah, that is why I want to, I bet is the point, though, that why when clients are frustrated, that’s like one of the underlying work, I mean, one thing is obviously, that I help them with is getting more visibility, and improve their communication skills and bid expert credibility so that these new opportunities start popping up like mushrooms left, right and center. But at the same time, and underlying, we are working on learning to love where you’re at, you know, it doesn’t mean that you have to stay there forever, doesn’t mean you have to tolerate everything. But learning to find some peace and contentment there. Because I can tell you, if you are going to job interviews, or even just informal conversations with in your current company, and you go in there with all of this frustration that you currently have. And all you can think about is Oh, as long as I get away from that thing, it just so seeps through, you’re not going to be your best, you’re not going to be excited about a new opportunity. You just want to get away from what you just said, nine, I just, you know, in the long run, you won’t like the reason that you had for making the change. And I’m all for liking my reasons for what am I doing?

Lisa Lewis Miller  33:07  

Well, I think it’s your positive psychology coaching coming out right now, Nicole, that your energy and your attitude that you bring into the work that you do impacts it, whether or not you think it will, it absolutely impacts your tone, your persistence, it impacts your creativity and your ability to think in a problem solving fashion. So finding a way to see the good, and to have the gratitude without mitigating the desire to leave or to grow into something else is I think both paradoxical and the key to being able to make a move to something that’s going to feel good. Yeah, I agree. That’s so so important. How does the positive psychology part of your area of expertise come to play when you’re having conversations with individuals who are unhappy and what they’re doing?

Nicole Tschierske  34:03  

Yeah, so a lot of the things are, so the first attitude is what we have, we want to be growth oriented, you know, we’re not, it’s not, it’s not merely about finding a solution to a problem, but it’s really, really seeing the growth and stimulating the growth that we that we can have, right where we’re at. And we start to look at things you know, those those typical elements or aspects that come with positive psychology that really help us burn to these moments of growth? Like, how can I find flow in my daily work? Where can I use my strengths more or in a different way? What are the moments and encounters in the day that we didn’t make me experience positive emotions and how can I have, even if it’s just one more of that each day? How can I find more meaning in the work that I do right now, even if it’s a bloody boring excel sheet, you know, so It is those small things of finding and finding those moments and those small little strategies that help us really, you know, our energy and motivation and engagement and job satisfaction. And again, we can still leave if we want to, but we’re doing it from a place of abundance, and from everything as possible, instead of from a place of desperation, please get me out of here.

Lisa Lewis Miller  35:25  

God, it makes such such a difference. I, I will sometimes teach a free webinar or a masterclass on job searching. And over the last year of the pandemic, and all of the economic instability that came with it. One of the biggest things that I would talk about is before we even talk about any of the tactics on what’s working, and how to get interviews and any of that, we’ve got to start with the mindset piece, that if you are walking into these informational interviews, with that sense of desperation, just like you were you were describing Nicole, I feel like I use this phrase a lot. But it it rings true that we always hope we are better liars than we actually are. You always hope that you can just paint on a smiling face, and people will believe it and buy it. Yeah. But if you’re showing up to those conversations, stressed, or scared, or feeling self doubt, it inevitably comes across in your energy and your demeanor and your word choice and how you tell your stories. So I think your point about being in a growth mindset, and thinking about what’s possible, and how you’re just on a journey can be so empowering and so helpful, even just as a singular step to take to get different results from your search. Yeah.

Nicole Tschierske  36:51  

And I just want to make clear to everyone, we’re not like, we’re not like we’re not stepping into an illusion here. Yeah, it’s like we’re not in this is not repeating positive affirmations, hoping that it will work somehow. But these are actually, these are actual proven strategies that help us flourish despite struggling, and that really do work. And they really create a change in and just bring forth our resourcefulness and all of those good things. And it’s not just, you know, saying like, Yeah, I’m fine here. Yeah, I’m fine. You know, it’s not that hollow, but it’s actually deep and so substantial, without being laborious.

Lisa Lewis Miller  37:35  

Yeah, so it’s such a good point, we are not advocating for you to lie to yourself, or try to deceive yourself, or to be in denial about your situation. It’s really more finding a more hopeful, more positive version of the truth, and a more hopeful, more positive situation that might be steeped in gratitude, that allows you to look at the same situation through a lens, it still is truthful, right? It’s still intellectually honest. But it changes the way that you feel about the situation. I love that clarification. Well, Nicole, as we come to the end of our conversation today, if someone has been listening to this and is curious about positive psychology and attitude in particular, do you have any parting advice on where someone might start with learning how to adopt a more hopeful, positive, but not delusional way of looking at your world and your situation?

Nicole Tschierske  38:40  

GSL. So, so many great resources. But in terms of So first of all, getting getting the insight about your own state of well being and to also get tailored advice, I really recommend the perma survey. So we can share the link but its p E, R, m h.com, or perma minus survey, sometimes when I give you the link, you can put it in the show notes. Find it anyways, this is a really, really great resource where you can you can take a psychological assessment and obviously so for one thing, it gives you scores on like, what is your current situation on positive emotions, your engagement using a strings, meaning in your work accomplishment, all of these good things. And it actually gives you based on what you choose, you want to you want to improve or tweak a little. It gives you tailored advice and things that you might want to try. And you can take it for free as many times as you like. And it just starts to you know, instead of listening to a bunch of TED talks or reading up on a ton of books, also, you know, it just gives you like one little piece to start with and To start, you know, observing yourself in different way in a different way and to, to just try new things. And that is then yeah, your how you start this little spiral of positives, positive change.

Lisa Lewis Miller  40:14  

Beautiful. I love that. And if somebody has been listening to this, Nicole and thinking, This is incredible, I love everything that she’s sharing. I want to learn more about this body of work and how she supports people. Where can they learn more about you?

Nicole Tschierske  40:29  

Yeah, so I’m active on LinkedIn almost every weekday. So you can find me there, you can hop over to my website, there’s a free guide for you on my five favorite strategies to promote your work without feeling sleazy about it. And then there’s one thing that is coming around every march in September is like one week of professional development, from the with advice from I always put a pool together and 10 really great experts who are so so generous in the tips that they give, and it’s free to sign up. And it’s called women in STEM reimagined. And now you don’t have to be a woman to attend. When you don’t worry, you also don’t have to work in a STEM field. But it’s just so that you know, people can find it.

Lisa Lewis Miller  41:20  

Wonderful. Well, those sound like great resources, and we will include links to all of those in the show notes for any of you listening. But Nicole, thank you so much for coming on the Career Clarity Show today and sharing about all the different tactics and strategies that you can use to either find more satisfaction where you are, where to start thinking about what might be next. Thanks for having me, Lisa enjoyed it.

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