Episode 109: Navigating Your Career Change Mindset with Chelle Johnson

One topic that is oftentimes neglected when we’re thinking about making a career change is mindset. One of the reasons why mindset can feel tricky to talk about is because so often when we’re going through a season of transition and change, what we want are the tactics: What do I need to do? What are the next steps? What’s going to get me results?

While the tactics are incredibly important, there is an unspoken piece to the tactics that can dramatically affect their success rate for you. That’s the attitude mindset and belief layer that sits on top. You can do the exact same tactics as every other job seeker, but if you aren’t feeling good about yourself or believe in what you’re doing, you’re not bringing positive energy to it.

If you find yourself in a position where you are trying to navigate making a change, and it just doesn’t feel like you’re getting the traction and results that you’re looking for, you are definitely going to want to listen to today’s episode. Chelle Johnson joins us to share the power of being in the right state of mind in making your tactics as effective as they possibly can be for you. 

Want to learn more about our strategic framework for successful career change? Download The Roadmap to Career Fulfillment ebook right here!

Show Notes:

• Best You Career Advantage
• Linkedin: Chelle Johnson
• Facebook: Best You Career Advantage
• Colorado Career Connectors group
• Roadmap to a Fulfilling Career eBook

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Transcript:

Lisa Lewis Miller  0:04

Welcome to the Career Clarity Show. If you want to create a career path you’ll love, you’re in the right place. I’m Lisa Lewis Miller, career change coach, published author and your host. And each week, we’ll bring you personal transformation stories, advice and insights from experts about how you can find a more fulfilling, soulful and joyful career.

Lisa Lewis Miller  0:31  

Hello, and welcome back to the Career Clarity Show, I am your host, Lisa Miller. And I am delighted as always that you are here with us today. On today’s episode of the show, we’re gonna be talking about a topic that is so so important, and oftentimes really neglected when we’re thinking about making a career change. And that is your mindset. And one of the reasons why mindset can sometimes feel a little bit tricky to talk about or to talk about effectively is because so often when we’re going through a season of transition and change, what we want are the tactics, what do I need to do? What are the next steps, what’s going to get me results, what is the action that I take next. And while the tactics are incredibly important, there is an unspoken piece to the tactics that can dramatically affect their success rate for you. And that’s the attitude mindset and belief layer that sits on top. Because if you do the exact same tactics as every other job seeker, but you aren’t feeling good about yourself, you don’t believe in what you’re doing, you’re not bringing positive energy to it, you’re not feeling hopeful or excited. Even if you execute on the things you’re supposed to do action wise, you may not get the results you’re looking for. And you might look at it and say I’m doing everything right, what’s wrong? Why can’t I figure this out? Why isn’t it working. So if you find yourself in a position where you are trying to navigate making a change, and it just doesn’t feel like you’re getting the traction and the momentum and the results that you’re looking for, despite doing the things you know you’re supposed to do, you are definitely going to want to listen to today’s episode. I am so excited for today’s guest. Because she knows the tactics inside and out, she will be able to tell you exactly what works for job hunting and job search. But more than that, her her extensive experience, she absolutely knows the power of being in the right state of mind in making your tactics as effective as they possibly can be for you. Today’s guest on the podcast is Shelly Johnson. Chelle is a first generation college graduate that grew up with limiting beliefs fear and dysfunction. Through faith resilience, grit and determination. She held executive leadership roles in talent acquisition and HR at fortune 50 companies such as Comcast, Lockheed Martin, quest diagnostics, and Honeywell. She’s lived in work in Asia, Latin America, and the US has an MBA and speak Spanish and English. And Chelle is now a career ally Changemaker and positive mental fitness authority, and helps high achievers and diversity allies amplify their awesome and have abundance in their career and life. She loves helping people get crystal clear on who they are and what they want, and is known for coaching people to listen to their inner wisdom, take risks, build their bravery, and have the courage to seek their best life. Chelle, welcome to the Career Clarity Show. Thank you so much for having me. Lisa, I’m excited to be with you. Well, I’m particularly excited to have you with us. Because I mean, my goodness, after hearing your bio, everybody listening to this knows that you know the ins and outs of job search and recruiting and what candidates are going through in the process and also what HR is going through as they’re screening people and trying to figure out who to interview and who to hire. And the fact that you have highlighted how important mindset and attitude is for this process, to me really indicates that there’s so much more to job searching and the nuance of it than what we think about when we’re thinking about the tactics of going on to a job site or creating the perfect version of your resume. And I always want to start our conversation today with how did you start to figure out what kind of a difference mindset made in people’s results?

Chelle Johnson  4:35  

Well, I’ve been super lucky and blessed in my career and I have always had very good luck with implementing a successful programs for those companies that you mentioned. And we would do these huge programs and bring in 100 200 candidates at the same time for like a Job Fair day. And when I was doing the final decision making sessions, the hiring leaders always were commenting on, you know, this person comes from a technical background, but they just don’t know how to collaborate or speak their truth, or they didn’t have the right mindset, or they just didn’t make an impression. And so it got me really interested in internal understanding how to speak your truth, knowing what you valuing, and really coming at life from a positive perspective, because I think each person I know, mice, my judge in my head is really loud. And when people are in the transition, and they are looking for a position, especially in a pandemic, when it had nothing to do with them, their performance probably was amazing. But the economy took a downturn, and industries that were very successful, like hospitality, and retail, and movie theaters really needed to shift those employees also, now I need to make a shift. And the tactics, I mean, that’s what you and I do every day. But my specialty is really understanding and I’m a holistic coach. In fact, I tell people, I’m not the right coach for you, if you’re just gonna stay superficial level or surface level, you have to be willing to go deeper, you have to dig, and really want to make a positive change for yourself. Think about it. I actually call my I do a lot of speaking and my signature speeches amplify your awesome. And when you look at what amplifying means, it’s really increasing, boosting, or intensifying who you are on the inside so that you can have a better resonance with how you are speaking and engaging with other people. If you’re down if you’re negative, if you have resentment, anger, self doubt, you feel felt like a failure or worthiness? How is that going to come across in your confidence, to courageously Be who you want to be in order to be yourself? So this topic might be pretty deep? And if your listeners are going, yes, that’s exactly how I feel? How do I change from those negative thoughts? And just that burnout, and stress? This is really what we’re going to get into today. And so I’m happy to go deeper with you.

Lisa Lewis Miller  7:46  

Excellent. Well, I I love the word amplify and the way that you’re thinking about taking what’s already inside of you, right, working with existing raw materials, and just turning up the energy so that there’s more resonance in turning up the volume so that there’s more resonance. And I’m curious, I don’t think that any of us kind of start out thinking, I want to play small, I want to be quiet. I don’t want to share about my full self. But what do you tend to see are the biggest reasons that people aren’t as amplified, or are playing smaller in their job search or in their lives?

Chelle Johnson  8:27  

Well, I absolutely understand exactly what you’re talking about. Because I felt that way. I was in a very large position and a great company. But I just wasn’t happy. I felt disconnected, disengaged, and my emotional intelligence at the time. It just kind of fizzled, because I wasn’t truly living to my own potential. So people when they do not have that confidence, and they have their power that’s being taken or that they’re giving away their power or their confidence, and they just feel small. They’re like not flamed or full potential. Getting them out of that cycle of insanity. And that cycle of disconnection, is you have to be courageous. You have to do what Bernie brown talks about. You got to embrace the suck. And you have to move forward in a very consistent, methodical way of this is not who I meant to be. When in 2019 I knew that I wanted to do something different because I knew that I wasn’t you. It’s like your soul is just screaming to do something different. But you don’t know how to do it. You don’t know what to do and that fear of an incompetent or where am I going to get the finances to do this, sir So for me, the pain of not being my best outweighed the fear of staying in a stagnant role where Honestly, I wasn’t my best anyway.

Lisa Lewis Miller  10:13  

That sounds like one of the biggest things that you see is people in stagnant roles where they’re not being challenged, they’re not being pushed, they may not have any opportunities to grow. And so it feels like the role is becoming this shrinking box around them, and really constraining their ability to feel like they’re speaking their full truth or contributed more or their full potential.

Chelle Johnson  10:35  

So it might be that where they feel like they’re just on a corporate treadmill, or doing the same thing every day and expecting a different result. Or it might be that something in them has changed, that they want something different, yet they don’t know the path, or what journey to take to go get that or they’re in a job transition where the journey has been placed in front of them, and they did not choose it. So in any of those situations. For me, this is why you and I do what we do is that we get to help people find their path, figure out how not just the tactical pieces, because the tactical pieces, there’s lots of free webinars, and you and I give free webinars, we, you know, you wrote a book about it. It’s much more about the inner critic, and quieting the inner critic, quieting the ping pong, monkey mind, and helping people to have perspective and amplitude and abundance versus scarcity. So, you know, I’m happy to talk through how I’ve done that with clients and kind of the transformation that I’ve seen, not just with that, but in life. You know, I was scared to death to start my own business. But I knew if I didn’t try something different, that I would be living the same routine, and I wasn’t happy, and my family life wasn’t happy. And now I’m an zuba. instructor, I get to work with clients every day that I choose to work with. And I absolutely love what I do. And my average increase in pay for my clients is now 22%. So it’s amazing when you can pivot and just help people amplify their own connectivity and their own awesome. I mean, you’re sitting here shaking your head, like I know that, you know, that awesome feeling. And we get the honor to to do that for people now.

Lisa Lewis Miller  12:41  

Absolutely. Well, I want to take you up on that offer to talk a bit more about the process. Because it sounds like when people find you they are in a mental space that feels scared, that’s very scarcity based, feeling worried and wondering if there’s anything else out there for them. What needs to happen for them to be able to land on the other side and find something great? Well,

Chelle Johnson  13:07  

the first thing is they have to be coachable. They have to have the pain where they want a partner to align with them and be their cheerleader and ally. But they have to make the decision on their own. They’re going to make a shift or a pivot in what they’re doing. Because what they’re doing isn’t working. And they I have my clients listen to podcasts and books like Gabby Bernstein, the universe has your back. For me, I know that when I’m trying to think through things and just be on my own and my controller comes out or my hyper achiever comes out that things will not get better. But if I know I’m partnering with others, and I’m really allowing the universe to kind of flow as it’s supposed to things land so much better than I could have even imagined. So, in June of last year, I was invited to participate in a program called positive intelligence. And I now am an affiliate with them. And I’ve had over 20 people go through the positive intelligence course. And there’s a book out there, it’s the best selling New York Times number one bestseller. It’s by shirzad shimmied and you can go to positive intelligence calm and you can look at the TED Talk. And it’s scientifically proven with over 500,000 people to neurologically change the neuro or scientifically change the neural pathways in your brain. So that that survival brain that is your inner critic and your judge is quieted over six weeks through if there’s an app that you put on your phone, it’s 15 to 20 minutes a day, but if you’re not consistent, you’re not going to get results. It’s Kind of like, We’re going into mental fitness. And yes, I’m a fitness instructor. But if I don’t, if I let that go and I’m not consistent about it, then I’m not going to be able to navigate and activate life and be as agile as I want to be the same is true. So the program really focuses on 15 to 20 minutes per day, for six weeks, one video an hour, long a week, and you’re even with a pod of other like minded people, or I do individual coaching as well. And I have some of the most amazing transformative stories that honestly just make me smile and have really helped and support others throughout the globe.

Lisa Lewis Miller  15:51  

Well, that bring us in share one of the stories with us what, what kind of a transformation can happen when you start to rewire your brain, because I I like the analogy so much thinking about it just like physical fitness and how if you’re trying to work a muscle group, or build a skill set, you know, you start from where you’re at, which might be having the muscles atrophy, it might be that you’ve never done that kind of work before. And the first part is gonna be hard. And you got to do the reps, and you have to have the consistency. And you have to turn it into a habit in order to create that kind of fitness and enduring strength. So what does that process look like when somebody is going through that with their brain? Where do you start? Where do you end up?

Chelle Johnson  16:35  

So you start with the program by aligning with a partner, or looking at the website, and you download all the apps. Once you start, you start on a Saturday, and you’re watching a video, and it explains week by week. And just like in fitness, and working out your muscles. The first three weeks are hard. They’re talking about that judge in your brain that a lot of people name, I have a client that has named her judge sassy pants, I have another client that has named her judge, Judge image judge MacPherson. You know, mine has a name, but it’s probably not for radio use or audio. And you name your judge, and you kind of understand what’s going on, and that what the judge is costing you by just doing things that same and now each person there are also nine accomplices with positive intelligence, I mentioned that I’m a controller and I’m a hyper achiever. The other ones might be like your might be restless or avoiding something a victim, hyper rational, hyper achieving, you know, etc. I know I’m not mentioning some but there are nine that you pick the top two, and then how does your controller for example, align with your judge? Let me give you an example. I can go into my house, and I can scan it after I get done working. And I can be like, okay, the dishes aren’t done. That’s not done. That’s not done. And I’m a stickler. But that’s another way that it compensates. Right. So you can it’s quieting that pause, and really think about how important is it that that dish is not there? How important is it? You know, so you you learn to? So after the first three weeks, you start focusing on the stage or your wisdom, and you’re really looking at different powers that you have to you can do different actions like Tell me more about that, or I love that idea. Yes. And it allows for more inclusivity and more understanding for people and anyone can use it anywhere. It’s not for any certain age. It’s just really about staying consistent. And the goal is to get to 400. And I have a client who just got to 400 yesterday, and she was at a business. It was toxic. HR was coming to her about her leader. She didn’t go to them, they came to her. And so she’s being interviewed about her leader, she’s like this is not where I want to be. So we did an exit strategy for her. We put her in the program. within three weeks, she found another job. She’s making more money. And after seven weeks in this program, all her onboarding has gone. Amazingly she’s gotten 100% on all of her audits her clients love her. And she’s now the kind of like, asked to be on kind of like a lead solutions architect for what she does another story is I worked with a battalion officer in the army, who is currently in Afghanistan. Can you imagine the stress and the burnout, and the pressure he was able to use, he would call in to our sessions at four o’clock am Afghanistan time. And the program literally helped him be a better leader, and help the troops be more productive in a very, very hostile area of Afghanistan. I mean, I can’t make this stuff up, right. And I do have recommendations on my website that this is I cannot make this up. This is real. So that was kind of a long winded version of some of the stories and how it’s done.

Lisa Lewis Miller  20:44  

Well, it sounds like the process of getting to know the ways in which you have internal voices that are keeping you small, is probably a big breakthrough in and of itself, of just noticing like, those are thoughts. They’re not part of my DNA, they are voices that I can shape that I can control that I can turn up the volume on that I can turn down the volume on. And it feels like just getting that level of awareness of Wow, these thoughts might be affecting my decisions, my productivity, the energy and the tone that I’m putting forward in my life. That sounds like that alone could be a game changer for people professionally, especially when thinking about how to approach a job search.

Chelle Johnson  21:36  

It’s a game changer. I mean, for me, I have always had faith over fear. But my fear was getting so big. And I knew in my guts, my heart, my soul that I’m like, this is not who I am. And there was this level and consistent discomfort with just who I am and how I was showing up that I knew for me that I had to make a change. And sometimes people push that so far down. And maybe just by listening to this podcast, they’ll be like, you know what, I know what it feels like to have anger about my job search or to feel resentment, that I wasn’t given that promotion, or have self doubt, after I wasn’t offered a position that I knew that I was more than qualified for, or to have a hiring manager, not want to interview me because I’m more qualified than the hiring manager. Right? These are all situations that people who are wanting to be promoted go through that job seekers go through. And it’s not just me think about if you can really hear that voice, and you know, in your gut, that something has to change. And that inner critic is just hijacking your success

Lisa Lewis Miller  22:48  

gap. Well, I imagine that’s probably something that listeners are intimately familiar with. Because one of the things that I talk about when it comes to these kinds of career moves is that, Surely there’s nothing that you and I tell people tactically, that’s rocket science, there’s not some sort of like secret nuclear code that if you do these exact things, and this ordered at this timing, you will immediately find the perfect job and everything will be solved and rainbows and glitter and unicorns will be exploding out of your computer. The tactics are pretty straightforward. But when you have mental stuff going on, whether that is an inner judge an inner stickler, whether it is feeling hopeless, feeling like a victim, that energy, and that mindset, can contaminate your activities, and make the tactics not actually work for you. Because you don’t believe in them. Or you’re self sabotaging. Or you’re procrastinating to the point that you actually don’t get things done at the timeline that you should, or when you talk to people, your energy comes off just the way that you were describing in those interviews as like, you know, you know, this person is qualified, but there’s just something that’s not the right fit. And I think that people, when they interact with somebody who’s in a difficult mental space, you know, where the judge is, at full blast volume, when you interact with somebody who’s going through that you can feel it, you know, there’s something weird and funky going on underneath the surface. Exactly. And we all kind of feel like we’re better liars than we are of like, I can just power through this interview, or I just need to put a smile on it. It’ll be fine. And I think that the examples that you’re talking about are really clear examples that like, No, no, no, if you are in a space, mentally and emotionally that isn’t rooted in hopefulness, creativity, positivity, you know, the possibility it’s going to come across Even if you think you’re doing the best job in the world at pretending that you’re, you’re hopeful when you’re not.

Chelle Johnson  25:08  

I cannot tell you how true that is. I mean, as the director of talent for big companies, and I’m also certified targeted selections, so they used to call me the closer like Marianna Rivera would be like I close out the baseball, meaning, I absolutely would want to dig deeper and really understand who they who I’m interviewing with, who are we going to bring into this company. And you can just the nonverbal communication, as you know, Lisa, is what 95%. And the tone, the way the accentuation in tonality, if that’s the word that all comes across, and you count on, some people can fake it till they make it. I mean, there are so many interviews, there’s so many YouTube videos on here’s how to interview. So people can fake it till they make it that they’re going to not make it to be their best. I mean, it is scientifically proven that sales teams are 37% more effective when their mindset is in the right space, that productivity goes out the window. And I just I also have a group called Colorado career connectors, and I had a friend of mine, who’s a compensation analyst talk about negotiating pay. And if you don’t negotiate pay in the right way, you can leave 500,000 to a million dollars on the table in your career. But she had in her conversation with our participants. The first thing we talked about was mindset of abundance versus scarcity. And then we talked about emotional intelligence, and how to have know your value to speak your value. Because if your mindsets not in the right place, I have a perfect example, I have a client who’s currently going through positive intelligence with me, she happens to be in human resources. And she is making lower than I feel she should and the market says. So we worked yesterday on just getting her mindset around a $25,000 increase. And that is the minimum of what she will now accept in a new job. And you know, she’s like, well, I don’t know if I’m worthy of that. Or, you know, that’s, that’s her own critic saying to her, no, you’re just going to suddenly be small. I’m saying No way, you’re not going to settle anymore. Because you are way too smart and damn good at what you do. That you’re not going to play small anymore. We’re going to get your mindset right, that you can speak about your confidence and courage. And you’re going to go and you’re going to be the first one in your family over six figures. Now that is positivity.

Lisa Lewis Miller  28:10  

Oh, Shelly, I really we’re gonna have a whole episode of the podcast. mindset when it comes to money. Oh my god. Things that we make money mean, about who we are, or aren’t. I’m greedy. I’m being overzealous, nobody would ever pay me that much. I can’t make more than my parents, there’s so many different layers of things that you have to wrestle with. And mindset comes into that to

Chelle Johnson  28:37  

its mindset and emotional intelligence. And having the when I first started my business, I was playing smaller. And I would charge like an hourly rate. I’ve more than doubled that now. And I know who I am, I know what I’m good at, I know my value. I want everyone else to know that too. And to feel that and to not just live tactically, I want every person and this is what this is what gives me like so much intrinsic positivity and happiness is like moving or allowing it to be paid forward. One of my clients literally just got a $75,000 increase in pay this Can you imagine what that’s like for his partner and him? I mean, and life changing money, life changing money. But more than that, the way he thought about it, and the way he approached it was life changing for his internally. So I now have lifelong friends because of the impact. And I’m sure you do too, is that I have no doubt that what our programs that we can provide. It’s not just the tactics. And I literally tell clients and like if you just want to be tactical, I’m not your right person. Because I’m going to really push you I’m kind of like a career therapist, but I’m not as I go therapy. listening to my agreement. I am not a psychotherapist. But you get into deep stuff. You’re shaking your head like you know what that is all about? Oh, yeah. Well, I

Chelle Johnson  30:10  

one of the things that I think is really tricky is that I think all of us, if we had our druthers would prefer that every solution to every problem in our lives was in like a 30 day whitest whites you’ve ever had money back guarantee extra bonus if you buy in the next five minutes, you know, kind of infomercial package and like too good to be true. And it’ll never feel and here’s all you got to do. It’s so easy. But I think the essence of your approach, you know, and ours to hear at Career Clarity Show is that God I go deep to hit paydirt to then be able to make the transition that you want, feel the way that you want it to, and to be more likely to be sustainable, and to give you longevity. And to give you a sense of fulfillment that isn’t just fleeting, or tied to ego stuff around like, Oh, I’m, I’m working for a company with a sparkly name, or, oh, I’m doing a title. I’m in a job now with a title that’s really cool and gonna be very impressive to my peers. It’s that that willingness to take some time, and go deep, and create some of those mental fitness and agility muscles that you were talking about, that then enable us to make different choices to put ourselves on different trajectories, to feel the sort of happiness and health that we want. And that’s available to us and our work is available. 

Chelle Johnson  31:40  

But it’s really hard to even believe that when you have been put down, you have had bad circumstances toxic bosses, you know, I understand having a toxic Boss, I understand being a toxic boss, because I wasn’t in my right mind frame. And I wasn’t living in a happy. I wasn’t happy with me. Right? So for anyone listening, just know that it is possible. But it’s not just about starting a program. It’s about growing, maintaining, and make sure that it’s consistent. Because without consistency greatness design does not come and success does not come without consistency. So I actually stole that from Dwayne Johnson. Yes, the rock. He has this. I mean, he used to be a wrestler right now he is a very famous, funny, good looking actor. And it was only through consistency. And you know, I’m trying to bring humor into this as well. It’s because life can be. It can be so much better if we learn how to quiet our inner critic, and live from our gut and live from our wisdom. And that’s what I hope that people hear from this session.

Lisa Lewis Miller  33:01  

I love that. I love it. I mean, the tagline we always end the Career Clarity Show with is life is too short to do work that doesn’t light you up. And so seeking out that, yeah, seeking out opportunities to be more lit up and be more on fire is such a worthwhile endeavor, especially when life is short. And as far as we know, we only get this one. So I am with you all the way there, Shelley. Now, if somebody has been listening to our conversation today and has been loving everything that you’ve been sharing and wants to learn more about you and your work, where are the best places for them to follow up?

Chelle Johnson  33:39  

Well, they can look me up on my website best u y o u career advantage.com. I’m also under Facebook, at best you career advantage. And they can look me up on LinkedIn under Shelley. And yes, it’s barreled a little weird. I’m ch e Ll E. Again, CH e Ll E, Shelly Johnson. And I’d love to chat with anyone really just about how you can be lit up and ignite your passion and have that abundance in life.

Lisa Lewis Miller  34:14  

I love it. Well, thank you so much for coming on the Career Clarity Show today and sharing all of your mindset information with us.

Chelle Johnson 34:22  

Thank you, Lisa, this was such a great partnership and just allowing different perspectives of not just the tactical piece of a job search, but really going deeper. And I’m so glad that you also do that for your clients.

Lisa Lewis Miller  34:36  

It’s all we got to do if we want people to get results,

Chelle Johnson  34:38  

right? It definitely is. And it really is about results. I mean, we wouldn’t be in business unless our clients had results. So

Lisa Lewis Miller  34:45  

Absolutely. Well cheers to holistic approaches that get results.

Lisa Lewis Miller  34:57  

And that’s a wrap. Let us know Have you thought about today’s episode? leave us a review on Apple podcasts because not only can your stars and words help us find great guests and topics to feature on future episodes, your input also helps other people find the resources they need to discover the work that lights them up. And make sure to check out my book Career Clarity Show finally find the work that fits your values and lifestyle. For the link to order it go to get Career Clarity show.com slash book and don’t forget to get your other tools resources and helpful goodies at get Career Clarity Show comm slash podcast. Thanks again for joining us for the Career Clarity Show today. And remember, if you don’t love your work, we should talk because life is too short to be doing work that doesn’t light you up. Talk to you next time.